Gary Tucker is a Midwestern Christian pastor and minister of Christ Cathedral. He is the author of a soon to be released book entitled "Face To Face: The Experience". He is very active and committed to missionary work wherever he is led of the Lord and is presently administering in a "sister" ministry called Stepping Out Inc. With an established background in psychology, Gary would soon experience something that would rock his foundation and affect this faith unlike anything he has ever faced in his life. After a bout with a life threatening illness, Gary has chosen to share his account with When Magazine on what could be one of the most riveting and provocative spiritual experiences ever.

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When Magazine: You have an awesome testimony to share with the world, Gary. Briefly tell me a little about your childhood and your upbringing; specifically, your testimony of how you found your way to the Lord.
Gary Tucker: Technically speaking, I did not find my way to the Lord. He was always there. When my memory kicked in after age three, the Lord was already there. You might say He found me. When my mother was a member of the Eastern Star, the male and female version of the Masons, in the same building, Mother bought me a 4 inch high plastic cross that glowed in the dark after being exposed to light. In my eighth year of life, one Saturday morning about 3:00 A.M., I suddenly awoke; I didn’t know why. That plastic cross was glowing in the dark. As I sat up in bed looking at that cross across the room, it began to grow brighter and brighter. That cross lit up my room so bright it was as if the roof and ceiling had been lifted off the house and the full moon was illuminating the inside. In the brightness of my room these words spilled out of my mouth, "Lord, do you have something for me?" At that time, my mother and I did not attend church regularly anywhere. Go figure.

WM: Does the church you are affiliated with have a strong outreach ministry?
Mr. Tucker: Technically speaking, at this time, my church does not regularly meet, but most of our members keep in touch regularly. The Lord suspended regular operations of Christ Cathedral, my church, July 28, 2007, so I could finish the book, Face to Face: The Experience. The book is at the publishers being assembled as we speak. Our outreach at this time is being performed through a "sister" ministry called Stepping Out, Inc. where my wife, Valerie Tucker, is the Associate Director. I meet there every Wednesday evening. I am performing mission work, remodeling my basement where the Executive Director, Patrice Puglise, technically a local missionary, lives. The Executive Director is the associated partner with my wife at that ministry.

WM: Okay, so where did that rank in your list of priorities? And was that a priority for you or near to your heart before your experience?
Mr. Tucker: My wife was an associated minister/social worker at Stepping Out before December 1997, the time of the experience. Valerie and Patrice headed up the prayer team that worked with God to save my life. In addition to my local responsibilities as "Pastor Gary" (at or of Christ Cathedral), although, admittedly, much of my "work" is prophetic (Who would have guessed?), I am doing mission work, remodeling (Paul was a tent maker), waiting to see what happens with the book, i.e. where will the book take me and when, if you know what I mean? Some of my people say I will be doing some traveling. God has another man, my former assistant pastor, to resume the work when called upon.

WM: Now, Gary, did you feel at the time of your hospital stay in December 2007 that you were connected with GOD and that your relationship with Him was solid?
Mr. Tucker: Technically speaking, my relationship with God has been consistent all my life, as I said previously. My present mission, as it were, was of course, solidified as a result of my experience, when God said, "You go on and get out of here and do what I called upon you to do." Since that time, I have attempted to walk out my calling as best I can by faith. What else is there to do?

WM: Makes sense! So did you realize there was a sense of urgency about spreading the Gospel before your experience as a minister?
Mr. Tucker: A "sense of urgency" is an understatement! My reaction to the experience, as I wrote in the book, was, "Oh, my, God! I’ve got to get out of here and get BUSY!"

WM: I'm sure that your sense and perception of the Lord was greater because of the transforming experience that you went through, but did you feel that your relationship with Him was stronger after you opened your eyes and found yourself back in the hospital?
Mr. Tucker: How do I say this? There are few words strong enough to describe my sense of urgency as I described in the book. I felt as normal as normal can be considering I did not know what had taken place "on earth" while I was "out." I only knew what happened where I "went" and I didn’t know how I was going to explain myself and have my experience be believed. Obviously, the experience was absolutely transforming and an infinite/eternal clarification on my life.

WM: I see. As being a believer as well, was your wife as awestruck and receptive to your detailed account of the experience?
Mr. Tucker: I asked her and Valerie reported that the doctor had told her that I had less than an hour to live. Technically, I was already dead with zero blood pressure for three hours. How awesome is that? I would speculate, given my training in psychology, Theological psychology (Th.D.), Valerie didn’t know what to think. I’m sure she had difficulty trying to process it all. Your mate doesn’t die every day.

WM: I’m interested to know if you shared your experience with both believers (besides your wife) and non-believers and what did you notice that differed or was similar in their responses? What did you learn about them from their reaction?
Mr. Tucker: After the experience and after my recovery, Valerie and I and Patrice visited different churches in the region. The same testimony was given to each group. No follow-up study was made with data collected for interpretation; however, all the people seemed to be highly impacted by the testimony. One pastor was contemplating moving to another church, but decided, after the testimony, to stay at the church where he was currently pastoring. At another church, after the testimony, during questions and prayer, one lady reported she was worried about her child in school. The child was of mixed race, black and white. I reported that I was mixed. She didn’t understand. I explained that I was born Scotch Irish, but was born again, Hebrew/Scotch Irish (engraphed [the Apostle Paul] into the vine, little brother to Jesus, so to speak).

WM: Although you would think it was expected, was your local church receptive and supportive of your account of what happened to you?
Mr. Tucker: My church believed my testimony unswervingly, much to my surprise. It seems that I had a pre-reputation for talking to God, holding daily two way conversations, annotated, many papers/pages.

WM: Gary, hearing the voice of the Lord is thrown around a lot these days. Did the voice you heard during your experience differ from the voice you heard in your normal daily walk? And if so, how?
Mr. Tucker: Good question, with many mental health issues to be considered, clinically speaking. The answer is no. God’s true voice is, by his power, unmistakable and discernable. How do I say this? When God talks to me, on a daily basis sometimes, my trained response is usually, "Yes Sir," although, in the privacy of our conversations, God seems to prefer a simple, "Yes, I hear you or Yes, I understand or Yes, I will do that." Sometimes God just wants to talk and have companionship with us individually.

WM: When you heard the voice of the Lord tell you that "Jesus was coming," how did that speak to you at that moment? What have you gained from it since?
Mr. Tucker: It was the voice of the Spirit announcing to me, "He was coming." I grew concerned. The Spirit resumed with, "He’s on His way!" My reaction was, "Oh, my, [gosh]! I’ve got to get busy!" I have been so since then. I finished the book, am working in my trade and waiting for further orders.

WM: Have you, during or since your experience, realized the significance of five (a theme throughout the experience you described, i.e. five jet planes, five columns, etc.)? Did you see a symbolic comparison in the Scriptures to help explain the significance?
Mr. Tucker: My understanding of Hebrew numerology is that the number five (5) is a symbol of "grace," i.e. studies of the Tabernacle. Exactly how all of these things correlate or tie together, I guess God will have to specify to each one that which God wants each one to understand. Scripture, of the mind of God, is infinite/eternal in the number of interpretations available. Perhaps the gift of interpretation, i.e. the Holy Spirit would help here (?).

WM: You mentioned that GOD asked you will you do what He told you to do. What did He tell you to do and when? What caused you to not complete the instruction prior?
Mr. Tucker: In the experience, during my interview with God, all He said to me was, ". . . go and do what I called thee to do." No further specification or explanation was given at that time. Since then, I have "walked" out that which I perceive I should do. I am confident that if I were not doing what God wanted me to do, He would tell me so. We are enjoined by scripture to walk by faith and not by sight and that is my understanding. Whether or not we have done everything "right" is up to Him. Most of the time, the Lord impresses upon me to do my best, and not to "sweat the small stuff."

WM: Did the experience alone help you realize that this needs to be addressed or were there other factors as well?
Mr. Tucker: It is an awesome thing to one day wake up and realize that your whole life belongs to God regardless of what you might have planned to do or think you want to do with your life. It is a process, i.e. time and patience. Abraham didn’t get "there" over night.

WM: Did and do you sense parallels to persons in the Scripture that had a visitation with GOD, and how has this affected your view of the Bible and yourself?
Mr. Tucker: I suppose I can identify with many of the personality traits of many of the people in the Bible, but then each of us is an individual in and of ourselves. The absolute stunning attribute of your question is that, to the best of my knowledge and memory, according to that which is, "written", that record, the Bible in total, no one seems to have seen God as He was shown to me. Now, what are we going to do with that? I don’t know. You tell me. I’m just me, as far as I know. Each of us is unique; never having been here before, and not coming back in this way, that I know of. I am kin, in the spirit, to Abraham, Moses, Joshua, David, etc.; however, according to the Bible, even Moses didn’t get to see the face of God as Moses requested. As was stated in the movie, "King David", even Moses was denied the supreme revelation. Why should I be so privileged? Go figure. What does all this mean? I don’t know. I just do what I’m told.

WM: Awesome! That makes perfect sense. How have you implemented your mandate from the Lord so far?
Mr. Tucker: So far, by faith, of course. It is a lifelong process.

WM: Are you finding that your change of approach towards the things of GOD have affected those around you, and in what way? I would imagine there’d be some.
Mr. Tucker: How could they help but be? Obviously my experience has changed me from the time it happened. And that change has affected me before, during and after the experience. It affected my whole life; eternally and otherwise. God went back in time, came to the present in ’97, and went beyond on the eternal scale.

WM: Physically, have you experienced the full healing that the Lord sent back with you? What has that afforded you the opportunity to do that you could not do prior?
Mr. Tucker: Without equivocation, I am totally healed, but I see that healing as a promise of God without preconditions, if you know what I mean? I believe it will be said of me, "Behold the man for whom time has stood still." I am as young and fit as I ever was. I’m not Superman, but I am physically, psychologically and spiritually fit. I assume I can only share that which I have. It is my opinion that "growing old" is an improper and inappropriate mind set (eternal life). When Moses passed away, the word says his strength has not abated, at 120 years.

WM: Coming face to face with the Creator of all things is a moment surely filled with fear and reverence, how has that affected the way you worship Him?
Mr. Tucker: Yes! I was awestruck. All I could say, face to face, in reply to His questions and statements, was, "U-huh" and "Okay." He smiled both times. However, since then I have entered into conversations with God, annotated almost daily, where we talk as best buddies, if you can believe that. He knows He’s God and doesn’t need to be reminded; only we need to be reminded. By the way, the word "worship" comes from the Old English word, "weorthscipe" meaning His "worth" ship.

WM: Thank you for your patience, Sir. I really appreciate you sharing with our readers and being candid. My final question for you is this: What was the biggest change in you after your experience?
Mr. Tucker: The biggest change is the set of my whole life. Again, it is an awesome thing to wake up one day and realize your whole life belongs to God whether you knew that or not. Think about it. One day God says, in His own way, "By the way, you belong to Me." And you realize that regardless of how you have lived your life thus far, it all belonged to Him from the beginning. Again, go figure. And by the way, thank you for your excellent questions. Good training for me, I’m sure. And, what is this, "Twenty Questions?" (Ha, ha). And by the way, Yusef, you are a very intelligent interviewer. I thought your questions were well thought out; complex at times, but very good. At least this doctor thinks so, for what that’s worth. And finally, in case you are wondering, my degree (Th.D.) is different; the clinical version of theological psychology. God raised and taught me to be clinical in nature.

WM: Gary, your answers were well thought out and very well given. Thank you very much for your time and patience.
Mr. Tucker: Thank you.